SPEAKER_01 0:00

You often emphasize the difference between college capable and college ready. I'm less focused on getting in than getting through and getting out. I believe you you referred to a term called lost generation. We didn't get special services, we didn't get diagnosed, we didn't, you know, didn't really feel understood necessarily.

SPEAKER_02 0:19

In AI's use, you know, within the application process.

SPEAKER_01 0:23

You know, experienced readers can tell when when something's been written by AI. You know, the the topic of AI is super complex, and we could easily spend a whole session on that.

SPEAKER_04 0:36

Welcome to Neurodiversity Today, the podcast where we shift the narrative on neurodiversity with your host, Kenneth Mims. Every week he sits down with amazing guests who share honest stories and break down the barriers of how we see the world. Whether you are neurodivergent yourself, a parent, educator, employer, or an ally, you belong right here. But before we get into it, if you love what we do here and want to help us grow, please take two seconds to hit that subscribe button, leave a quick like, and share this episode with a friend. It really helps the channel to reach more people. Now, let's jump right in.

SPEAKER_02 1:10

Dr.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

Eric Endlick, uh, are you neurodivergent? I am. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:15

It took me most of my life to figure it out, but uh finally got there. Well, join the club, join the club. Um, and that's just something that I asked all my guests to to just, you know, to create a safe, positive environment, you know, safe space, but more importantly, you know, that leads into you know our journeys. And can you talk about how that has led into your journey as a professional and and and where you where you know where where are you at as a professional?

SPEAKER_01 1:44

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so I am a clinical psychologist by profession, worked for a very long time in a variety of mental health settings, including working with neurodivergent clients as a therapist. And uh our own children are neurodivergent as well. Um, our son was diagnosed at two and a half uh with autism, uh ADHD, other diagnoses. And so my wife and I were really thrust into the autism world pretty intensively. Um, that was back in 1999, uh when uh shortly after our second child was born. And so we were going to conferences, reading books, etc. Um, I like I said, I was working with neurodivergent clients as well. And then one day we were both sitting at an autism conference, and we both just simultaneously realized I'm autistic as well. And I also realized here's my dad was definitely autistic too. Um, kind of all hit us at the same time. And that really kind of shifted my journey. I really focused more uh exclusively or intensively on neurodivergent clients, um, learned a lot about neurodiversity, and eventually ended up pivoting to educational consulting. And now I do that exclusively, working with neurodivergent students around the country to apply to college and occasionally to grad school.

SPEAKER_02 3:16

So so if I heard you correctly, some you know, somewhere within your parenting journey you discovered, you know um that you were um autistic?

SPEAKER_01 3:28

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 3:30

And and so that was also uh, you know, throughout your your um your professional practice career. So how did the diagnosis reframe you know, like your past and uh, you know, influence, you know, your clinical work?

SPEAKER_01 3:46

Yeah, well, it's it's life-changing as anybody with uh a diagnosis knows, and I'm self-identified, but as a psychologist, uh some per someone put it, you know, you were professionally diagnosed since I'm a professional. Um, you know, I think of it as my our son's diagnosis changed our future, and my diagnosis changed my past. So it really caused me to rethink everything up to that point and see my life through a different lens. Um, I went to a meeting with other neurodivergent professionals, other neurodivergent mental health professionals, met someone else who was already working on a book and ended up being a co-author on a book called Older Autistic Adults, which you can find on Amazon. And we surveyed 150 autistic adults around the world to understand uh our shared experiences. And the most common when asking folks, you know, what was your reaction to diagnosis, the number one reaction was relief. And a lot of people said things like, you know, if only I'd known earlier, it would have, you know, it so makes sense of so many things. And I I absolutely relate to that. It really helped me understand, you know, one of the there's a a model of um autism, the the nine degrees of autism. The first is knowing that we're different, but not knowing why. You know, children figured that out from a pretty early age. Hey, I there's something's different, can't put my finger on it. Maybe you never figure that out. Um, or you know, in case for some of us, figure it out somewhere along the way, midlife or or later.

SPEAKER_02 5:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:35

It definitely helps you re-rethink and and understand why things played out the way they did. You know, I always thought of myself as being intense, intensely focused on things. You know, now my my profession is helping students apply to college. So autism and college are two of my special interests. And I always had some sort of special interest, whether it was astronomy or herpetology, um, building model rockets, reading science fiction, you know, long list of things. Um, there was always something that I was deeply focused on, photography at another point. And, you know, that was just the way I was. Um, but not everybody else in my family was the same way.

SPEAKER_02 6:18

Yeah. And so your book um called Older. Older artistic adults, adults. Yeah. You you I I believe you you referred to a term called uh lost generation. Yes. Can we talk just a little bit about you know, you know, that term and and and how it relates to you know um uh neurodiversity?

SPEAKER_01 6:40

Yes. Well, Wilma Wake, my co-author, had this idea, and you know, I think other folks have have thought about it similarly too, that for those of us growing up in that time period, uh, for me, six in the 1960s and 70s, you know, autism wasn't very well understood. Uh, you know, Asperger's work hadn't even made it into the DSM, you know, the Asperger term, which then later got removed, wasn't even in the diagnostic manual yet. So there was really very little recognition of folks who were like us. Um, there was more of a very narrow concept of the sort of classical autism, Leo Canner, um, people like my son, perhaps. And so a lot of us kind of flew under the radar for much of our lives. So we were a lost generation and that we weren't, we didn't get special services, we didn't get diagnosed, we didn't, you know, didn't really feel understood necessarily. So that that's the idea there.

SPEAKER_02 7:49

Now, you know, you you you you make a very interesting point. You know, many um individuals, you know, you know, are part of that, you know, particular generation or that particular generation of that were you know that would be included within this um you know lost generation. But I'm curious to to hear how your your journey, your story, you know, um impacts how you advised neurodivergent teenagers today.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

Well, I think it helps me really connect with them, empathize with them. I love working with twice exceptional students or two e students, that is, those who have a learning difference and are also intellectually gifted or have some talent. And so, you know, when they're talking about their intense interest, I really relate to that. Sometimes it's a similar interest, sometimes it isn't, but I completely understand that that compulsion to really throw yourself into something. Um, and also as a special needs parent, I understand the journey both of them through their school system and and what their parents have gone through trying to advocate for their children. So, you know, parents can be frustrated or discouraged that you know one particular school hasn't worked out or particular therapy hasn't panned out. And you know, we it was a long journey for us too. So I definitely relate to them. But I think relating to the the students themselves is kind of the heart of it.

SPEAKER_02 9:29

Yeah, that that that ability to to to see and understand you know and provide the empathy is is is definitely uh um uh added value, you know, and something that's definitely needed. Now, you you talk about uh you know uh you know your practice, top college consultants, and and you and you're supporting students to transition you know to uh to uh to college. Now, you you often uh emphasize the difference between a student being um college capable and college ready. You know, what are the primary you know non-academic skills you know that neurodivergent students struggle with uh when moving away from home?

SPEAKER_01 10:19

Yeah, well, uh they need to master a lot of the same schools that skills that neurotypical students do. It just maybe some of them didn't fall into place quite as easily. So as you you know indicated, the the academic skills in many cases, not always, but in many cases, that's really the least of our concerns. Uh parents may be very focused on that, and students maybe also. Are my grades good enough? Are my test scores good enough to get into this college? You know, do I have what it takes to get in? I'm less focused on getting in than getting through and getting out. Uh, or as I put it in an article I wrote, getting into college is the easy part because you've got four years or maybe even more than four years ahead of you after that to get through. And there's all these other skills, self-advocacy in particular, that uh students need to realize they they're gonna have to call upon when they get to college. So if you've been in the special ed system under an IEP and individualized education plan or a 504 plan where you're getting accommodations andor services in in kindergarten through 12th grade, when you shift to higher education, it's a different system. There's a hard stop at 12th grade. It's a different law that applies, and it's a different system. And parents don't always realize that. So they expect things to kind of keep working the same way, and they don't. So as a high school student, if you're getting special services or accommodations, they're they're kind of pushed out to you, delivered to you. You just show up at school, you go to the resource room, you meet with the learning specialist, you get your accommodations in the classroom. You don't have to kind of kick and scream to get those things to happen. Maybe the parents advocated to make them happen, but the child typically doesn't have to do a lot. They just they're just delivered. That ends after high school when you get the diploma, and parents are kind of out of the picture after that. They they kind of need to take a backseat. Colleges treat students like adults legally, even if they're not quite 18 yet. I mean, I was 17 when I started, but they they still treat you as an adult in the sense that uh they're communicating with you, the student, directly, not your parents. And if you don't proactively go to the disability services office or the support program or what have you, and disclose that you have a diagnosis and that you need accommodations and services, it doesn't happen. You could go through all of college without getting any accommodations or services, even if you have a disability. And that's not just learning differences, that could be a physical or medical disability.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

Your computer doesn't crash just because it runs a different operating system, it just processes things in its own way. So why do we expect every human brain to run the exact same way? Colleagues who process data, sound, or time differently aren't broken. They just run on a different, equally valuable code. Let's build better workplaces for all employees. Design an environment that supports every operating system. This message is brought to you by Neurodiversity today.

SPEAKER_01 13:38

So you, the student, have to self-advocate, step up, declare that you have a diagnosis, explain what kind of help and accommodations you need, and then continue to advocate for yourself. Because maybe you get that list of accommodations and you go to a professor, and maybe they say, Oh, no, I'm I'm not willing to do that. I don't do that in my class. Well, they may not be legally allowed to say that, but that doesn't mean they that it never happens. And again, you, the student, have to self-advocate with the professor or going back to other professionals to help, you know, run interference for you. So there's the self-advocacy. They're also just sort of knowing what you need, knowing that, you know, oh, I'm I'm struggling emotionally, I need to go to the counseling center, I'm struggling academically, I need to go to the tutoring center. All those resources are there, just like they are for neurotypical students. But you have to take the the initiative to pursue them. Um and then neurodivergent students often struggle with executive function, time management, organizational skills planning. And so having some sort of help with that, like an executive function coach or an academic coach, can really help you succeed in college because the structure just sort of falls away when you go to college. The instructors are not saying, hey, remember there's a there's a quiz on Friday, remember to work on your paper over the weekend. They're not necessarily giving you those reminders. You get the syllabus at the beginning of the term, and then it is up to you to do the reading, do the assignments, study for the tests. And often, you know, there might be one final, there might be a midterm and a final. A lot of the grade hangs on a few assignments or tests. And you, the student, have to really kind of stay on top of that. So there's the executive function piece. And then sometimes there's also social challenges, making friends in a new environment, or independent living skills, you know, waking yourself up on time, getting going to the health center if you have a um an illness, um, things like that. So it's it's a range of skills that that all students need to have, but neurodivergent students sometimes struggle with more.

SPEAKER_02 16:02

Yeah, that definitely, you know, that that you know, you talk about the self-advocacy piece, but also the self-awareness, you know, for for students to be able to be aware of what they need to advocate for. You know, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

Self-awareness is like I think of as the foundation, the bedrock. First, you have to know what you you know, know what your diagnosis is, know what your needs are, know what your vulnerabilities are. If you're vulnerable to depression or an eating disorder or excessive gaming or panic attacks, social isolation, whatever that is that you are are liable to do under stress or in a new environment, knowing that about yourself so that you can take steps to address it, whether that's getting help or doing things that are going to help you feel better, you know, going to the gym, going for a walk, talking to friends, listening to music. You got to know that about yourself so that you can keep pushing forwards.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

Now, now this makes me think, you know, some of this are, you know, needs to be considered considered prior to applying to um to college, you know. So, you know, the aspect of navigating higher ed, you know, it needs to be a little bit of you know thought. You know, so what are some of the key features of I guess what you call a autism-friendly college? Are the list and how do you specialize campus, you know, support programs, um uh specialized campus programs, you know, how do they differ, you know, from you know, basic and and and you talked about things that are legally mandated.

SPEAKER_01 17:34

Right, right. Um, yeah. Can Yeah, that's why we that's a big part of you know what we do and why families come to us is to is the c the list building part, figuring out of the 4,000 colleges in the US, which ones will be the best fit. Now, there's there's a lot of factors that go into that, including the same factors that a neurotypical student would care about, like the size of the college, how far from home, how how much does it cost, does it offer the majors that you're interested in studying, all the usual suspects, so to speak. But in addition, does it provide the support you need to be successful? And as you alluded to, virtually all colleges provide legally mandated accommodations. So things that you might be familiar with in high school already, like getting extra time on tests or getting the instructor's notes or sitting in the front of the class. Those are academic accommodations. But if you need additional things like academic coaching for executive functioning or social skills workshops or social events to help you make friends, those are offered in comprehensive, robust autism support programs, which are only in a tiny fraction of colleges or learning support programs. It's not just for autistic students. There are learning support programs for other diagnoses as well. And I, yes, as you said, I created a database on the Top College Consultants website, which is free and sortable. And we looked at, you know, which colleges do offer these additional programs. Um, so it's it's a small fraction of the colleges. It's a it's a growing number, so it's great to see new programs coming online, but most colleges don't go the extra mile. Umone, so that's something families should know. And then the College Autism Network that I'm I'm on the board of that organization uh has a committee that's looking to designate certain colleges as being autism friendly as a campus, as a whole university. Um, there's an organization in Europe that's done that with a handful of European universities. And that's kind of a different approach of, you know, has the college as a whole embrace neurodiversity? And I really hope and think that's where we're going as a society to create universal accommodations in the same way that, you know, nowadays you're traveling around by by wheelchair. There may be ramps to get up, um, get into a building, or elevators, or electric doors to make it easier to get, you know, push buttons to get in and out of the building. That makes it easier for everyone, not just if you're in a wheelchair, but you know, if you're carrying a lot of groceries or you're on a scooter or something. So um the same idea applies to learning differences too. You can create, you can design things to be universally accessible.

SPEAKER_02 20:34

Now, I was talking to one guest recently, and they made a statement that uh uh 56% of uh Gen Z identify as being neurodivergent. And so, with that, you you have also stated that neurodiversity should be uh uh included in a college uh you know uh definition of uh diversity. Can you talk a little bit about why why you feel that way?

SPEAKER_01 21:00

Um yeah, I can see you you I really did a deep dive. Thank you. Um I think diversity, embracing diversity benefits all of us. I think we are stronger when we have more inclusive, diverse environments. For example, when it comes to learning differences, whether it's in the classroom or in the workplace, great minds don't all think alike. So we we come at problems differently. And if you are trying to solve a problem, whether that's a big societal-wide problem or a problem in a classroom, having people who think differently means different perspectives and more creativity, more flexibility, more chances that you're going to come up with one or more effective solutions. And so I think embracing neurodiversity benefits all of us. It helps us understand that we're All unique in one fashion or another. And of course, some people um have intersectionality, they they have different, multiple different identities, whether it's their neurodivergence, race, social class, gender, and um, you know, I can't speak for other people who are in different groups, but I I can appreciate how that makes life even more challenging if you feel marginalized for several reasons. So the more we can be inclusive, uh the more we can all be successful together.

SPEAKER_02 22:35

Now, now work with kids, so many kids, parents, in schools, universities, across the nation. Do across or do you work? Yes, I work with students around the country. But how about outside of the country? Yeah. Do we do that?

SPEAKER_01 22:48

Uh I've had a few students outside the country. Yeah. I've had some in South America, Europe, uh, wow, Asia. Yeah. Okay, well, it's tricky with time zones, but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:59

But yeah, you know, so working with, you know, on a global scale, um you you see you have a unique perspective. You see a lot of, you know, you see what's going on. So what would you say the single biggest change you wish all universities would make to accommodate, you know, you know, students, you know, that are neurodivergent?

SPEAKER_01 23:19

I guess that would it's hard to pick one, but uh the first that comes to mind is Universal Design for Learning or UDL. Um, you know, I kind of gave that that analogy for making buildings accessible. You can do the same thing with curriculum, making it more accessible. Like I talked to a professor um at a university in Arizona who said, um, I don't need to give my students extra time. I don't need to get, you know, focus on their individual accommodations. All students get as much time as they need. So there's no issue of, oh, some students get more time than others. It's not fair, etc. One of the problems with the current system where you have to self-advocate, like we were talking about earlier, is it puts all the burden on the individual, that these 17-year-olds, 18-year-olds going off to college have to suddenly, you know, push back against these adults and professionals around them and have sharp elbows to get their needs met, as opposed to creating a system, you know, it would be like somebody in a wheelchair having to, you know, make a phone call and say, hey, can you have someone come out and lift my wheelchair up onto the curb? It's a whole lot easier if you don't have all that extra um those steps for anyone. So universal design for learning would be number one. And then I think just sending the message to neurodivergent students that you're welcome. Just like I think we need to send that message to students of all groups, whether it's race, gender, um, social class, that this is a diverse campus, that we welcome students who don't all think the same or look the same. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:00

You know, I I I hope, you know, I hope uh they're listening to you. And I think over time, you know, as time goes on, there's gonna have to be, you know, a shift in in different, you know, in different aspects of, you know, of uh education. And and and one aspect is um, you know, is the abdication process, you know. Um and so um can you talk a little bit about that? The college application process, you know, includes essay writing and deadlines and and um testing, you know, extreme testing to some degree. Um you know, particularly testing of executive uh functioning. You know, what practical strategies do you use to lower, you know, anxiety during the submission cycle for your for your families and students that you work with?

SPEAKER_01 25:54

Yeah, well, you said the application process needs to change. It is changing all the time. It is a moving target. And um that, you know, one of the things I love about this work is there's always stuff to learn because it's always changing. The pandemic, there was already a test optional movement when the pandemic struck, but that really accelerated things because students just couldn't physically go to testing sites and be tested in person for tests like the ACT or SAT. And so we now have thousands of colleges that are test optional or in some cases test-free, what some people call test blind. And that means that if you're a student who doesn't do that well on standardized tests or has test anxiety and doesn't want to have that additional stress.

SPEAKER_03 26:42

How does your organization view different ways of thinking? Do you see hurdles or do you see hidden power? Meet Kenneth Mims, a dynamic TEDx speaker, global advocate, and founder of the Neurodiversity Education Research Center. He is a world-recognized expert in neuro-affirming, strength-based practices that change how we learn, work, and lead. From corporate boardrooms to university halls and K-12 schools, Kenneth gives your team the inspiration and motivation needed, along with actionable tools to move past old labels to tap into innovative potential. Foster true inclusion by booking Kenneth Mims at KennethMims.com today.

SPEAKER_01 27:23

You can take that off the table for the most part. There are some states where the public universities require them, and there's there's a number of private colleges that have gone back to requiring them, but it's it's a small number in the grand scheme of things. So if a student comes to us and says, I don't do well on tests, or I do I have to take an SAT, you know, good news is no, they're they're fine. Um, I've had students who either didn't take a test at all or tested and didn't get test scores that would really help them very much and and didn't submit them. So that's a huge plus. That's really helped a lot of our students. And that's probably the most dramatic example.

SPEAKER_02 28:08

You know, um you you make me think about um you know, the consideration, you know, rather the conversation that we have uh in this space around uh disclosure. I talk a lot, a lot of my audience and a lot of my guests, you know, are in the in the work setting. Yes. You know, this is just this is part of the process. Um and so there's a conversation around disclosure, but there's also that same conversation um uh in college as far as when students are applying to college. You know, can you just talk about, you know, briefly talk about your thoughts, your perspectives, what are you what what you were seeing, because um it's something real. You know, parents have to make that decision.

SPEAKER_01 28:56

Yeah, and I usually address that question in webinars because it comes up so I know someone's gonna ask it if I don't bring it up. Um I did a whole presentation on that topic and written blog posts on that topic, too, that you can find on our website. Uh, first of all, disclosure can happen, you know, a number of times. It isn't always just a one-and-done thing. Um, just like if someone is gay and they're coming out, uh, you don't necessarily come out just once in your lifetime. There may be many people you meet over your lifetime to come out to. So, same thing with disclosure. Maybe you disclose in the application process that you have uh a learning difference. But then what about to your peers when you're in the classroom or in the residence hall? Do you disclose to them that you're neurodivergent? That decision can come up over and over again. It's a personal decision. I don't tell students what they should or shouldn't do. Generally, if a student has done super well in high school and there's nothing concerning on their transcript or application, there's no reason that they should disclose if they want to because they feel like it's an important part of their story. They're absolutely welcome to. Um, on the other hand, if there's something in their journey or visible on their transcript that might jump out at an application reader, hey, why'd you go to so many schools? Uh, why were your grades lower here? Why didn't you take this type of class? Um, if you are proactive in explaining that, then you are, I think, in a stronger position rather than letting the application reader guess what happened. I was just talking to a student this morning about that very topic of why your grades were a certain at a certain point in this year and look different in this year. Um, if you don't explain that proactively, colleges are going to think, who knows what they'll think? They may think like, oh, you were just uh slacking off and hanging out with your buddies. Um as opposed to you went to a school that had a more um rigorous curriculum or there was something going on with, you know, uh medication or mental health or whatever it might be. I had a student one year who didn't take any foreign language courses. He explained proactively why that was, and he got into a college that says right on their website that they require foreign languages. So some of those requirements may there might be flexibility if you have a good reason.

SPEAKER_02 31:32

You know, that makes me excuse me. That makes me uh excuse me one second, let me take a sip of water. Excuse me. That makes me just think about um you know, just in the current day around um um AI, you know, and and you and AI's use, you know, within the abdication process potentially, you know, as far as um there may be some things like that, you know, that uh may be um you know, you know, you know, not in the you know, not supporting or not, you know, not able to understand, you know, you know, when something in in the student's abdication, you know, has you know, some type of so-called gaps or it just doesn't fit within the the algorithm. Are you are you finding that consistently, you know, at times as far as you know, maybe neurodivergent students are not, you know, their profile isn't necessarily uh aligned with algorithms or just the abdication um evaluation process?

SPEAKER_01 32:53

Well, we curate the lists very carefully. You know, we're really careful about matching students to schools where we believe they will thrive. And so they they tend to do well. Some of our students get into every college they apply to. It's all about you know building that list and and getting it right the first time. Uh the the topic of AI is super complex, and we could easily spend a whole session on that. It's it's pretty hot, as you can imagine, and has been since Chat GPT hit the news. It's something that that folks are talking about all the time. Certainly, um, students are expected to not use AI in the process of say writing their essays or or applications. And the AI detectors are not reliable, so they um that you know they they have false positives, so I you know really hope that colleges are not leaning into that to using AI detectors, which are not reliable. You know, experienced readers can tell when something's been written by AI. You know, I read news articles, I can tell which ones are written by AI, I can tell when I'm listening to a podcast or something that it's an AI voice. Uh, that's not to say that colleges aren't using AI algorithms to read applications. That's a whole different part of the um process. When they are dealing with you know 100,000 applications, some colleges have chosen to use AI algorithms for part of the process. It doesn't mean that there isn't a human being reading the essays, but there might be certain kinds of screening uh first passed to see if if they're a good match for the university on certain criteria.

SPEAKER_02 34:51

As we close out, you know, um this episode, I just one I have one last question around this the list, you know, the critical step, which is creating that list. Yes, and you and you talk about environmental fit versus um maybe considering uh institutions like prestige uh when selecting that university. Can you just talk a little bit uh a little bit more, you know, about you know that environmental environmental fit when you're building out that list? Because that seems to be maybe one of the most important things.

SPEAKER_01 35:26

Yeah, absolutely. Um some people call it vibe or culture, you know, finding a place where you're gonna thrive, where you're gonna, where you're gonna make friends and feel welcomed and feel like you've landed in the right place. I think for some students, if you go to college and it checks a lot of the boxes, but you don't connect with the students around you, you don't make any friends, and you feel like, oh, this is not my crowd, you're gonna want to leave. Not just about whether you can hack it um academically. If you can't connect socially, I think many students are gonna want to transfer somewhere else and feel like, I don't know how I ended up here, but this is not my place. This is not, these are not my people. Sometimes I've had students say they can tell that sitting in the waiting room for for an interview or for a tour, that they look around, they see other students and like, ooh, this is not my crowd of kids. So, you know, families are doing that research by going out and doing boots on the ground tours, if possible, in person. It's not necessary, but that can really help you get a sense of who else is there. You can, of course, do virtual tours, you can go on social media, talk to other parents, find out, hey, how many other quirky kids are there? How many other kids are there who are like you know, my kid and fill in the description of the profile? So that's definitely something that folks are looking at and I think should look at. Prestige, you know, most of the people that I know who do this work are focused on fit, finding a good fit, not focused on getting into the college with the most brand name recognition. Because that really doesn't buy you much in life. It may be exciting to brag to your family and friends that you've gotten to this college that everybody's heard of. But after that, five minutes of excitement and sharing that on social media or putting the bumper sticker on your car, then what? What does that really buy you? You're still going to be there for years. You still have to thrive there and be happy there. And once you graduate college, um, that name doesn't, for in many fields, doesn't matter a whole lot. Employers are looking at what are your job skills? Where have you worked? Do you have the experience? Do you have the skills to do this job? Not what's the name of the college that you graduated from. Now there may be a handful of fields where that's not the case, but in most fields, that that's the case. There's also exceptions for certain types of students. So for most students, the research shows that those differences are not as impactful as you would think. But for first gen students whose parents didn't go to college, or for students who are come from marginalized groups for one reason or another, maybe economically marginalized, going to a highly prestigious college can make a big difference because it connects you to a network of people that you never would have connected with that can help you through life, those connections in, you know, introducing you to someone to get an internship or a job. Whereas if you come from a highly privileged family, your family already has those connections. So your family can introduce you to the president of a company or a university or whatever it is. Um, so there are groups where the prestige really can give a bump. And I've I've had some of those students.

SPEAKER_02 38:56

Where can where can parents find out, you know, parents students find, you know, find out more information about you know your company and and the services that you provide?

SPEAKER_01 39:06

I would say go to the website, topcollegeconsultants.com. Um, you can find us on social media too. Well most most are all the major platforms.

SPEAKER_02 39:17

And as far as the the the books um that you've written?

SPEAKER_01 39:22

Um I co-wrote Older Autistic Adults, which you can find on Amazon. Um, and as far as contacting me, you can also email me at Eric Eri C at Top College Consultants.com.

SPEAKER_02 39:34

Okay. Eric, I appreciate you so much for joining us on this episode. Um thanks for having me. Yeah, and I and I'm excited. You know, I look forward to you know uh parents, students reaching out and getting the support, you know, that they need to get into these uh top colleges. Thank you. All right, thank you so much. Bye.

SPEAKER_04 39:56

Thank you so much for listening to today's episode. We hope it informed and inspired you with new insights and understanding. Please take a moment to subscribe, like, and share this channel. Your support helps these vital conversations reach the listeners who need this the most. To connect with our guests and fellow listeners, access exclusive content, and stay updated on our upcoming live events. Join our growing community on LinkedIn. You can find the direct link in the show notes below. Until next time, keep embracing neurodiversity and all things mental.